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On Health with Houston Methodist
Gut Microbiome Tests: What They Do (& Don't) Tell You
What if there were tests that could determine which foods to add or subtract from your diet for optimal health? That’s just one of many overarching claims of the various gut microbiome tests now available and gaining popularity online. But can an over-the-counter test really tell you how healthy (or unhealthy) your gut microbiome is? A gastroenterologist breaks down what you should know about these expensive consumer health tests.
Expert: Dr. Christopher Fan, gastroenterologist
Notable topics:
- The differences between tests gastroenterologists use and at-home tests
- Is there a true definition of a healthy gut microbiome?
- Do we actually know which microbes are “good" or “bad?”
- Can you address constipation, bloating and other symptoms through these tests?
- Leaky gut: The truth about this term making the rounds online
- Who (if anyone) might benefit from gut microbiome testing
- Actions you can take to promote a healthy, happy gut microbiome
If you enjoy these kinds of conversations, be sure to subscribe. And for more topics like this, visit our blog at houstonmethodist.org/blog.
♪ ♪
ZACH MOORE:Welcome to On Health with Houston Methodist. I'm Zach Moore, I'm a photographer and editor here, and I'm also a long-time podcaster.
KIM RIVERA HUSTON-WEBER:I'm Kim Rivera Huston-Weber, and I'm a copywriter here at Houston Methodist.
ZACH:So, Kim, gut microbiome is a big buzzword these days, I feel.
KIM:Yeah. I think a lot of people are paying more attention to their GI health, people are having a lot more awareness of symptoms they might be having, whether it's constipation or diarrhea, et cetera, et cetera.
ZACH:All the fun stuff.
KIM:All the super fun stuff. I think that's really what's leading people to do more discovery about themselves. And so, it's leading them to these over-the-counter tests that are being marketed, where they're saying they'll be able to tell you everything you need to know about your gut microbiome.
ZACH:Yeah. We are a very data-driven society now, I feel, especially when it comes to health. We want to monitor our steps, we want to monitor our calories, and we want to monitor, well, our gut microbiome. And it's one of these cases where we're just trying to connect the dots, I feel, because you'd say,"Oh man, I had spicy food, I had heartburn," or et cetera, whatever that might cause your body to do afterward, and we've all had these kind of like, surface-level understandings. But I feel like this is trying to truly understand them all, right?
KIM:Yeah. And so, I think there are lots of companies that are developing these various tests that are offering what they're saying are"individualized solutions" to your diet, maybe offering you supplements to try to hack your gut microbiome so you understand those connections. I think that's why these tests are becoming popular, because people want to know more about themselves and understand, you know,"If I eat Brussels sprouts, then this happens." People are trying to understand those connections for themselves, whereas doing an elimination diet doesn't seem that exciting. But if you were to easily just take a test and they'll tell you everything you need to know, that's really alluring, right?
ZACH:Right. Speaking of these tests, have you taken one of these?
KIM:I have not. We'll talk about it in the episode, but they're pretty pricey, so no, I haven't tried it. Have you?
ZACH:No, for the same reason. It's one of those cases where, yeah, if you have a medical need to, if your doctor suggests it, if you have a health deficiency or an illness, something that prompts it, sure, absolutely, I'll do that, no matter what the cost, right? But for something just out of curiosity, until I need to do it, I don't intend to do it. That's just where I am.
KIM:Yeah, for sure.
ZACH:I feel like a lot of listeners might be... You might be fascinated by the term "gut microbiome," because like I said, it seems to be one of those buzzwords, or buzz phrases I should say, it's more than one word, buzz phrases right now in medical circles and whatnot, you see it pop up on social media, 10 things you didn't know about... That's the reason we're doing this podcast, for example, right?
KIM:For sure.
ZACH:But you might think,"Oh, cool, I'll get one of those tests," and then you look into it, and you're like,"Eh, maybe I'll wait." I feel like a lot of us are going to end up in that same boat that you and I are in.
KIM:Yeah, for sure.
ZACH:But who do we talk to about gut microbiome today, Kim?
KIM:Sure. We spoke with Dr. Christopher Fan, he's a gastroenterologist here at Houston Methodist.♪ ♪Thank you so much for being with us today, Dr. Fan.
DR. CHRISTOPHER FAN:Of course.
KIM:To start, I'd like you to share what the microbiome is, and what can it tell us about our overall health?
DR. FAN:Yeah. So the gastrointestinal microbiome are basically the bacteria that live in the gastrointestinal tract, and by and large, these bacteria have formed a symbiotic relationship with us and help us actually digest a lot of nutrients. What can happen though is that based on dietary patterns or based on inflammation, the gut microbiome can adapt to those changes, and sometimes they're actually causative, right? So in some cases, when you have a GI infection, those changes can actually cause inflammation, right. And so, the microbiome is basically the composition of everything in the GI tract that can actually contribute to health and disease processes.
KIM:Got it. From what I can tell, the gut microbiome is having a little bit of a moment, especially online, so I'd love for you to talk about gut microbiome testing and how it works. Is there testing that is used by clinicians and providers? How are those used?
DR. FAN:Historically speaking, microbiome tests have largely looked at the identification of pathogens, and so specific bacteria or protozoans that commonly affect humans, and the way that those tests are done is basically via a PCR test, so they're actually sequencing the DNA and detecting whether or not these bacteria actually exist. So it's very targeted, it's looking at specific bacteria and it's not looking at the whole composition. I would say in general, right now, the landscape of microbiome testing is still very investigational, and so there's a lot of evidence to suggest that there are specific changes of specific bacteria that may indicate health or indicate disease, but the question really is whether or not these things are causative and whether or not they actually have a high predictive capability of predicting disease activity. For example, there are a lot of things that we know about the gut microbiome in studying patients longitudinally, is that there's, actually, based on your dietary patterns, there can be huge variations in the composition of your GI tract. So with that, there may be even more diversity between samples collected maybe by each month for each patient than between different patients. So because of that, it's really hard to pinpoint at one instance whether or not you're at risk, because there's so many factors that can actually affect your GI tract, probably most commonly, diet, and also things like antibiotics.
KIM:These clinical tests that are being used, it seems like there's newer tests out there that are being marketed direct-to-consumer. Can you talk about what those differences are in what's out there in the market versus what is being used by gastroenterologists?
DR. FAN:Yeah. So for example, when patients have symptoms, such as acute-onset diarrhea after traveling or something like that, they have a higher likelihood of having a pathogen, right. And so, what ends up happening is we collect their stool, they get sent out for PCR testing, for looking at specific bacteria, right. And so we're looking at the pathogens specifically, so, it's very, very targeted, very, very focused. What a lot of these tests that are, kind of, available in these kits for consumers now, they test for a variety of different types of bacteria, using a similar process, by identifying either metabolites or even the specific DNA that's present in the stool. Where that can get tricky is we know, based on rigorous scientific data, that specific pathogens cause symptoms in hosts and can cause inflammation and can cause acute diarrheal symptoms. But what we don't know is, outside of those pathogens, those that are probably common bacteria that are seen as commensals, or form this symbiotic relationship with the host, whether or not they actually contribute to disease processes. And what we also don't know is if it's transferable, so if one person has an enrichment of a specific bacteria, whether or not a second person with that same enrichment actually has the same symptoms. Microbiological studies have indicated that these pathogens that we test from a clinical perspective are actually known to cause disease, whereas the flip side, not much could be said about that, or the data is not conclusive enough for us to really be able to make these broad conclusions.
KIM:I, kind of, looked broadly at several different of these microbiome test kits out there, and so a lot of them are making claims, right, that they can improve the health of your microbiome, often through personalized food lists to add or eliminate from your diet, and they offer, conveniently, supplements that they sell that are supposed to aid in, I guess, healing your microbiome. So what I'm curious about is, does the medical community have a shared understanding or definition of what constitutes as a healthy gut microbiome, and is this shared definition what companies are basing their guidance on, or do we just not know?
DR. FAN:There's a general belief across the medical community that there are probably specific types of diet that are actually beneficial, and I'll take a little bit of a step back. I think as clinicians historically, we've been a little bit reluctant, right, to place so much blame or so much causative effect in the microbiome and diet, but I think we're beginning to realize now that actually diet plays a huge role in inflammation. We kind of know that from the rising obesity rates, the rise of inflammation, based on the things that patients are more readily consuming nowadays than maybe 50 years ago. And so, part of the blame is also on physicians for not recognizing that contribution a little bit earlier. The general medical community probably recognizes specific diets, things like the Mediterranean diet, as being mostly beneficial, right? And that promotes the presence of specific bacteria that produce short-chain fatty acids, which are also thought to be beneficial. And so, there is this understanding, right, that these bacteria can potentially promote health and homeostasis. Even in our inflammatory bowel disease population, which I frequently see as a gastroenterologist, you know, there are epidemiological studies that suggest and interventional studies that suggest that these diets are beneficial because they promote the presence of specific bacteria. So it's not to say that there's no scientific basis for a lot of this. What hasn't been really shown is whether or not what is captured in these kits actually can prove cause and effect, and that you are deficient, for example, in specific, for example, metabolites, like short-chain fatty acids, and whether or not the supplement intervention, kind of, performs better than, let's say, a dietary intervention, right. Like, it may be that you could switch over to a Mediterranean diet and actually get a better effect, right? And an improvement in your GI gut microbiome. So I would hesitate a little bit, just because a lot of this area with DNA testing and microbiome testing and supplements are fairly unregulated, and so it becomes a challenge for physicians, because there's no large randomized controlled data to really suggest this, right, and it ends up being mostly behind, kinda, proprietary and business doors, the data that they might have, right? I think most of the time, most gastroenterologists would not recommend these kinds of things, because there's not rigorous science behind it.
KIM:So something that I'm curious to know is that some of the at-home tests are sharing lists of everything that they've found in the consumer's microbiome. Can we reliably say what microbes are good and which ones are bad with any kind of reliability?
DR. FAN:This kinda gets back to the initial question of, well, how do gastroenterologists or infectious disease doctors interpret microbiome-based tests? And I think there's been rigorous studies in specific pathogens, like E. coli, for example, Salmonella, right? Giardia, and these are known pathogens, and so if you transfer this pathogen from host to host, they cause a reproducible effect. Whereas some bacteria, and the data suggests this as well, it really depends on the host whether or not specific bacteria may be beneficial or may be harmful. For example, there are some bacteria out there that are mucin degraders, and in specific contexts, they can actually be beneficial, right, because they help digest the mucin that's produced in the gastrointestinal tract. But in other hosts, they may actually be deleterious, right, and so they might actually cause more harm, because they thin the mucus layer and then cause issues for the patients. And so, the problem with this kind of reductive thinking a little bit is that it really is contextual, and so there are host characteristics that are also at play here that change the likelihood of whether or not specific bacteria are beneficial or not. And so, I don't think that these tests have enough of that clinical metadata to really be able to let us know whether or not this would be beneficial or harmful for the host.
KIM:That's interesting, because so many of them seem to give what they consider to be personalized guidance for whomever is using it. And that kind of goes into my next question about a lot of the marketing materials for these kits state that they can give consumers insights and tools to address certain symptoms, whether it's constipation, bloating, up to big things, like anxiety, depression, brain fog and body composition. So based on current research, what do we know about interventions for these issues that can be achieved by addressing the gut microbiome or our GI health?
DR. FAN:There are specific instances where altering the gastrointestinal microbiome resets a niche that allows for maybe a more healthy environment. So there are randomized controlled trials and two products now on the market that look at preventing specific types of infection that might happen after something called Clostridium difficile, which is a common infection that we see in the hospital and hospital-based settings. And there's a microbiome-based product that basically helps restore the GI tract to a more healthy niche environment so that these pathogens can't grow. I think right now, a lot of the products are challenging in that we don't know necessarily what the direct effect is, and we don't know whether or not that direct effect of what that product is actually has a beneficial effect for the host. And so, I think it's only in very specific instances, for example, in an infection, where we actually have reliable microbiome-based evidence to suggest that, hey, this actually does change the overall environment, it does not allow this pathogen to grow. Whereas, like I said in the beginning, there's so many confounders that can alter the GI tract, things like antibiotic use, things like dietary habits and dietary changes, that can actually cause profound changes in your GI tract, and even traveling. And so, things like that are not really accounted for, and I don't know that whoever's making these kits have enough that data to really be able to personalize their treatment recommendations♪ ♪
KIM:Up after the break, Dr. Fan talks about what you can do to promote a healthy gut microbiome.
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KIM:On social media, there are lots of folks talking about using these gut microbiome tests to aid with, quote-unquote,"leaky gut" and a constellation of symptoms that they attribute to the condition, including GI distress, brain fog, fatigue. Is leaky gut a real condition, and if so, what do we know about it?
DR. FAN:Yeah. So as with most things, there's some semblance of truth to this leaky gut phenomenon and there's science behind it as well. So instances of inflammation, obviously the GI tract is lined by epithelium and immune cells, and those immune cells help protect the GI tract from basically bacteria from going across that barrier into your bloodstream, and so when there is chronic inflammation, for example, in patients with IBD or Crohn's or ulcerative colitis, or even things like celiac disease, there are alterations in that barrier. And so, if there's active inflammation, things are more likely to translocate across, that can cause changes in the immune tolerance, and that can also change the composition of your GI tract. So there is some truth to it, and there are tests to determine how things are actually transporting across that barrier. The thing that's, again, a little bit unknown is we have a sense, there's some preclinical data to suggest that things like short-chain fatty acids promote intestinal barrier healing and decrease the translocation of bacteria across it and decrease overall inflammation, but whether or not we are able to sufficiently get high enough concentrations of short-chain fatty acids into the GI tract to actually promote that barrier integrity, and whether or not that's the driving process for every kind of GI ailment, is unknown. As with most things, it's not like a one-size-fits-all solution, and so it's probably too reductive to think that just by increasing short-chain fatty acid production by specific bacteria, that you're able to reduce the likelihood of all diseases. I would say in general, the data is not strong enough right now to really support that. Now, to your point about brain fog and a lot of these kind of symptoms, what we say more so are like functional symptoms, we know that diet probably plays a role in that. And then, by extension, if you think diet plays a role, then probably the bacteria and then gut composition probably also plays a role. And what I usually like to tell my patients is you probably have the best sense of what foods cause issues with your GI tract, and sometimes taking a simple food diary can help actually eliminate things that can cause you symptoms, right. By and large, we have an entity called irritable bowel syndrome, which is basically a functional disorder of the GI tract, where you feel pain, bloating, nausea, gas, a lot of these symptoms, but there's no clear evidence of GI inflammation that we can see or cause for that. And there are diets that we recommend, things like a FODMAP diet, and these are things that are not as easily digested in the gastrointestinal tract and so they can cause a lot of these symptoms. And so, part of that is actually determining what food products patients are eating and which ones are causing symptoms, and then eliminating those things. And so, there is some data to suggest that that process actually does work and can actually alleviate a lot of the symptoms. Now, as to why these food products are causing these symptoms, it's probably related to some malabsorption or inability to digest specific types of foods that's causing it. I would say in general, it is also not a one-size-fits-all thing and it's very personal to each patient, and so it should give patients and consumers pause when they say,"Oh, if we just do a test on your GI tract, this recommendation is going to fit you," right, because the data for even the FODMAP diet, or kind of elimination diets, don't even suggest that it's the same thing that's causing issues for multiple people.
KIM:Interesting. Another thing about these at-home tests is that they don't come cheap, and neither do the associated diet or supplement subscriptions that follow the testing or the retesting that the company suggests you do to, quote,"monitor your progress." So who, if anyone, would benefit from this type of gut microbiome testing, and is there really any harm to completing one of these at-home tests?
DR. FAN:I would say that at this point, it's probably too early. The industry is too much in its like nascent phase to really be able to figure out the utility of these interventions. I will say that the risk of harm probably is outside of supplements, because sometimes supplements can actually do more damage than good, and it depends really on the specific type of supplement that we're talking about, because sometimes these supplements are not actually FDA-regulated and so they can have effects that we have not studied rigorously. But dietary interventions, by and large, are less likely to have large-scale adverse effects, outside of if you have celiac disease or you have some true gluten issues, you probably will have low risk. The issue is that the out-of-pocket costs for a lot of these tests are fairly high, right, and they're not covered by insurance, and that should also give you a little bit of a pause, because insurance companies will likely pay for things that they think actually may benefit the patient and reduce their cost future down the line, right. And so, if insurance companies are not paying for it, it also is possible that this is not a time-tested kind of intervention or investigative study, and so the data generally supports that. It's not to say that in the future, gastroenterologists, infectious disease doctors, health experts, may find an actual kind of signature for beneficial bacteria, that's possible. It's just that we don't know that to be true at this stage.
KIM:Do we realistically need any tests to actively help or adapt our microbiome, and what are the actions that we could take to actively promote a healthy microbiome?
DR. FAN:This question actually comes up a lot in my own clinical practice, because, you know, in inflammatory bowel disease, we know that the things that actually increase the risk of disease activity are environmental and also genetic, right, so there's host factors and then there's environmental factors that actually increase the likelihood of flare activity. And so, patients always ask me, "Oh, what can I do for my GI help? Is there probiotics that I can take? Are there microbiome-based products or are there dietary interventions?" And there are studies out of Northern Europe, and these are studies looking at actually children, right, who go on, some of them, to develop inflammatory bowel disease, and looking at what they consumed in early childhood that might've increased their risk. And what they found was that sweetened beverages, more red meat consumption, things like that, and low probably dietary fiber consumption actually increased your risk. And this, by and large, is consistent with a lot of data supporting the use of a Mediterranean diet to generally promote health and reduce cardiovascular inflammation, right. And so, patients ask me this, I basically say to try to stay away from as much processed food as you can. Simple sugars are not necessarily good for you. Try to stay away from red meat if you're going to eat meat, try lean meat, things like poultry and fish if possible, and then try to increase your fiber intake. We have data to suggest that these things may actually help. And usually, these interventions you can go and do today, right, and go to the supermarket and buy things and change your diet. I think we have a tendency to want a simple quick fix, right? It would be great, honestly, if one single supplement could fix all my ailments, right. But the likelihood of that being true is probably not the case. And so, these dietary interventions, sticking to like a Mediterranean diet... In fact, we actually have a study that we're doing in our inflammatory bowel disease patients, where we're looking at Mediterranean diet compared to a standard American diet and seeing inflammatory markers, and seeing how that ultimately improves the composition of the GI tract and also inflammation.
KIM:That's so interesting. And so, I think it's fair to say that most Americans aren't consuming enough fiber in their day. How much fiber should we be aiming for, and is it better for a person to get that fiber from eating whole grains versus trying to use something that's a supplement that they could add to their drink to get that fiber?
DR. FAN:I would say in general, dietary fiber consumption in the U.S. at least is on the low side. What we generally recommend, this is a little bit different in specific populations, for example, in our IBD, because some patients can't actually tolerate fiber, I would say it's probably best to try to eat as much fiber as you can in your diet. And some patients actually do need supplemental fiber for reasons outside of just the beneficial GI gut microbiome, they need it to help draw in fluid into their stool and help pass stool if they're constipated, for example, right. It's likely that vegetarians, those that are consuming maybe a more higher percent composition of fiber in their diet, actually have a better health outcome because of their fiber composition, right. And so, there is some association with red meat and colon cancer, but it's unclear whether or not that's because more people are eating red meat at the cost of not eating enough fiber, right. And so, it's actually the fiber intake that's actually beneficial, and so if you ate enough fiber with your red meat, you might actually be okay. In general, the recommendation is to try to eat as much as you can tolerate. Some patients will actually have more symptoms related to fiber intake, some might have diarrhea or some might actually have more bulkier stools, and so it really depends on each patient, right, and kind of how they can tolerate it.
KIM:And is there ever too much fiber?
DR. FAN:I would say there's only too much fiber if you're having symptoms because you're consuming too much, that would probably be the upper limit, because there are times where you consume enough fiber where you're just having diarrhea because your stools are too loose and you're drawing too much fluid into the GI tract, and that can sometimes be an issue for patients.
KIM:We kind of talked about getting as much fiber as we can, trying to make sure that we're limiting meat, we're practicing a Mediterranean diet. Is it about consistency? Because we talked about how we would all like a quick fix. Is it more about just the practice of doing these things, versus how long would it conceivably take for us to see improvements in our health if we're doing these things?
DR. FAN:Yeah. So with diet and exercise, you can see effects actually very quickly. But I think it would require, on some level, like a cultural shift, right, because a lot of the things that we consume are solely based out of convenience and the food industry highly processing a lot of our food. That's why there's a lot of push even for healthy interventions for young kids, because if you learn these habits early and you try to stay away and shy away from eating more processed foods, then there's a likelihood that you'll stick to that growing up, and those kinds of interventions probably have longer-lasting effects, right. And I shouldn't single out the U.S., this is happening around the world, right. Obesity rates and a lot of inflammation-related comorbidities are growing at a staggering pace across the world.
KIM:Is there anything that we haven't covered on this topic that you might want a potential patient or a consumer to understand?
DR. FAN:I would suggest discussing whether or not some of these microbiome kits might be suitable for you with your doctor, right, because they would probably know best. I would say that there aren't any instances right now that come to mind where some of these tests can actually prove to be helpful, and before you spend a couple of hundred dollars on a test that may not actually benefit you, it's probably best to at least consult with either a gastroenterologist that you see or your primary care doctor. That would be my kind of overall suggestion. That's probably true of most things medical, right? Unfortunately, as I kinda said before, the medical establishment has kind of historically turned a blind eye to these kinds of interventions, diet being one of them. But we're slowly beginning to realize that they do play an important role, it's just that we don't know what the beneficial bacteria are for all patients, and whether or not that's translatable for all patients as well.
KIM:Yeah. I thought you made a really good point about, since it's such a high cost for a lot of these tests, that if it's not covered by insurance, you can't use your FSA or HSA, that's the cost you're absorbing to do the test, and if it's something that your doctor or your gastroenterologist wouldn't recommend, then, you know ...
DR. FAN:Yeah, you have to weigh the costs and benefits of it, right?
KIM:Yeah.
DR. FAN:And again, as much as there's... I don't know which side of the insurance industry you want to be on, but they're also not covering these tests. And so, most validated tests are actually covered by health insurance, by and large, right, and so that should also sway how much evidence there is to support some of the findings that they claim to have, right, that contribute to disease activity.
KIM:Well, thank you so much for being with us today, Dr. Fan, this has been a very exciting conversation. I feel like I learned so much, because I didn't know anything about testing before today.
DR. FAN:Absolutely. Always happy to share.♪ ♪
ZACH:All right. Can we mention the tests off the top?
KIM:Yeah.
ZACH:And I think a big reason that you really can't live and die by these tests, right now anyway, is because they're not a one-size-fits-all, right. Everybody's ecosystem inside of their body is different, so you can't look at a test and have these, quote-unquote,"standards" and say,"Oh, did you meet your standard ratio of," quote-unquote,"'good to bad microbes' in your body?" Because that's not going to be accurate across the board.
KIM:Yeah. I think Dr. Fan was suggesting that maybe the technology might not be there, or at least that there really isn't that broad scientific data to back up what these tests are offering folks. But I thought he made a really great point, that if you are interested in learning more about your gut health, your gut microbiome, you know, talk with your doctor, if you're interested in taking one of these tests or, you know, exploring an elimination diet or exploring... If you do one of these tests and you want to try out their -- whatever diet they suggest, you know, just make sure that you're doing that with the support of a gastroenterologist or your primary care physician. I think that's like the big headline.
ZACH:Absolutely. Another thing y'all talked about was supplements, and we've talked about supplements on and off on this podcast many times. And I think the key to supplements is in the name itself, a supplement, it's supposed to supplement your diet. If you're taking more supplements than you are food, then that's a problem, that's an imbalance.
KIM:Yeah. And I think a lot of the tests are offering diet solutions, they're offering supplements, and Dr. Fan was pretty clear, that there probably isn't going to be much harm in you playing with your diet, maybe adding whole foods and really working on your diet and getting more fiber, but always be wary of supplements, because they're not regulated, and so they might do more harm than good sometimes, so buyer beware there.
ZACH:Yeah. So are you more, less, the same, interested in the gut microbiome after this conversation?
KIM:I mean, I think the science and just that it's such a developing field is so very interesting. I think for myself... You know what? I don't think I would do a test, just because, you know, I don't have some of the GI symptoms that might prompt some folks to like explore having a test like that. And also, I think as we try to hack so much more about like getting 10,000 steps and like what zone are you in when you exercise, just the more we try to, I don't know, datify our lives, I feel myself pulling back.
ZACH:Data fatigue.
KIM:Yeah, yeah, it's just like --
ZACH:One other thing to keep track of, right?
KIM:Exactly. And so, I think that's just why it probably wouldn't be for me. What about you?
ZACH:Yeah, I don't think I would do it personally. I have a pretty good gauge... I'm fortunate, where I don't have IBS, things of that nature, so I have a pretty good gauge, not to get too graphic, right, but if you eat something, you're going to have certain result, right, and I think that's kinda common sense. So I can make those calibrations myself, and at this point in time, I don't feel compelled to go take a test about it. Now, as I get older, if I have other health concerns, absolutely, if that is proposed to me and absolutely recommended by, you know, my doctor, then I would do it. But until then, I think I'm going to pass on the tests for now.
KIM:Yeah, for sure, I feel the same way. If the testing gets to a point where it seems like it's really good, solid science and my doctor's like, "Yo, you should do this," I'll do it.
ZACH:There it is. Solid advice. So that's going to do it for this episode of On Health with Houston Methodist. Be sure to share, like and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts. We drop episodes Tuesday mornings. So until next time, stay tuned and stay healthy.♪ ♪